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Print Page - account ban......?

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The 'Other' Section => AnesisRO Archive => Archive => General Questions => Topic started by: bLitzkr!eg on February 13, 2011, 10:57:03 am

Title: account ban......?
Post by: bLitzkr!eg on February 13, 2011, 10:57:03 am
So if you got account ban(not IP ban) for ad fraud, can you still play the game and start over again?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: SanRath on February 13, 2011, 11:03:17 am
The GMs always give players another chance to restart.  You have to be seriously bad to get an IP ban.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 13, 2011, 11:04:42 am
If you were banned for ad fraud, you are not allowed to create another forum account (every new forum account will be banned), but you may create new ingame accounts, of course, to start over. However, if you created a new ingame account, and ban evaded on the forums by creating a new account there, your newly made ingame account might be banned as well for ban evasion.


... at least, that was the ruling back when I was still the one responsible for the ad fraud bans. However, since it wasn't possible to ad fraud since I left, the ruling shouldn't have changed. There are no such things as IP bans ingame. At least as far as I know of. Maybe only for extreme cases, but at my time, we didn't IP ban anyone ingame.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: bLitzkr!eg on February 13, 2011, 11:19:45 am
But I dont see any rules where it states that all newly create account can be banned if you created a new forum account.
Coz my friend got banned for that reason (I think). He got ban 1 year ago for ad fraud. He created a new account soon after a GM mentioned that he can do so. And 1 year later, he got banned again for supposedly "ban evasion". Now im not sure if he did create a new forum account, but then again, I dont see any rule that specifically states you cant create a new forum account and also Why they waited this long after getting back on his feet again just to get all his hard work taken away like a grown up taking a toy from a baby.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Roon on February 13, 2011, 11:21:59 am
has he made a support ticket explaining everything? It does sound really unfair D: esp. since there isn't even ads to fraud right now
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 13, 2011, 11:42:43 am
But I dont see any rules where it states that all newly create account can be banned if you created a new forum account.
Coz my friend got banned for that reason (I think). He got ban 1 year ago for ad fraud. He created a new account soon after a GM mentioned that he can do so. And 1 year later, he got banned again for supposedly "ban evasion". Now im not sure if he did create a new forum account, but then again, I dont see any rule that specifically states you cant create a new forum account and also Why they waited this long after getting back on his feet again just to get all his hard work taken away like a grown up taking a toy from a baby.
Well, it should be one of the most well known rules that creating another forum account when you are banned is against the rules. Besides, as stated in the punishment guidelines:
Quote
Major Offenses

such as:
- Continued Killstealing/Looting/MPK/Illegal Monster Spawning (after 4th offense)
- Continued Harassment/False Advertisement/Illegal Warping (after 3rd offense)
- Botting
- GM Impersonation & severe GM Disrespect
- Other Server Advertisement
- Interserver Trading & RMT (Real Money Trading)
- Divulging GM Identity
- Scamming
- Ad Frauding
- Continued Forum Ban Evasion
- Exploiting Bugs

1st offense = Permanent ban on all accounts belonging to the IP registered with the offender.
In fact, I was the one who added that line to the rules, since it hasn't been there before and I think players also complained because of it.

Anyway, seeing that some players who were perma banned on the forums have been allowed to make new accounts (Dew/Hexaea, that Bryan23 guy), and that the offense is quite old, maybe ... one of the current GMs has a soft spot for him? Although bans for ad fraud are usually considered more severe than a ban for insulting a GM or whatever they were banned for, so it's highly unlikely that anything will happen.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: bLitzkr!eg on February 13, 2011, 11:59:20 am
"continued" forum ban evasion. As far as I know, he might have 2 forum account. 1st is the original account that's associated to the banned account. 2nd is when he created those new accounts after he got banned. So "continued forum ban evasion" dont seem to apply to him since he never did have more than 2 forum account.

It's just odd for him to get banned again 1 year after creating those new account from an offense. It just doesnt make sense to me.
Also, like it matters now since we dont have any ad sponsor to begin with.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 13, 2011, 12:12:42 pm
Well, as you said, you just THINK that he has been banned because of this. That means that he might just as well had another forum account before that one. Well, if that's not the case, tell him, and he should mention it in the support ticket, the GM should be able to check.

Also, even if he has been banned 1 year after he started playing again, if he just created his second or third forum account now, well ... it's still an offense. If you think those rules are not necessary anymore, ask for a change? It's not me to decide on it, although I'd be against it, since those rules are a necessary evil just in case you get ad sponsors back sometime in the future.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: bLitzkr!eg on February 13, 2011, 12:23:25 pm
I just spoke to him and he confirmed he only got those 2 forum account. he created the 2nd account soon after he got banned. so its not like its a newly created account.

Oh well, I just hope they can resolve the matter sooner than later. He's a good guy, he learned his lessons before. I dont think he deserved to get ban again.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: bLitzkr!eg on February 20, 2011, 05:37:44 am
I just want to bump this up to get some GM explanation as my friends ticket was left unanswered for days.
Yes it was explained that he was banned for banned evasion. but still....

quick recap:

He started playing awhile back 2009. Did some silly stuff(ad fraud) and got banned February 2010. Former GM, Fidelis advice him thats he can just create new accts. So he created one soon after he got banned. 2 months later, he created 2nd forum acct since his first one got banned aswell. Then Febuary 2011 GM Tesla banned him for banned evasion.

I would understand if he purposely try to evade the ban, but he was told that he can just create a new one and start all over again.
It just makes no sense for the GM to deny him all the hard work that he put in trying get himself back on track.

Its unfortunate that he has to go through this whole ordeal. I'm disappointed to the GM/s action on his case.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 20, 2011, 08:44:52 am
I just want to bump this up to get some GM explanation as my friends ticket was left unanswered for days.
Yes it was explained that he was banned for banned evasion. but still....

quick recap:

He started playing awhile back 2009. Did some silly stuff(ad fraud) and got banned February 2010. Former GM, Fidelis advice him thats he can just create new accts. So he created one soon after he got banned. 2 months later, he created 2nd forum acct since his first one got banned aswell. Then Febuary 2011 GM Tesla banned him for banned evasion.

I would understand if he purposely try to evade the ban, but he was told that he can just create a new one and start all over again.
It just makes no sense for the GM to deny him all the hard work that he put in trying get himself back on track.

Its unfortunate that he has to go through this whole ordeal. I'm disappointed to the GM/s action on his case.
Yeah, it's not the GM's fault that he broke the rules back then, to begin with. Also, the GM told him to make a new INGAME account, but he made a new FORUM account. Don't always make it seem like the GMs are at fault for everything.

Anyway, why do you bump this topic? You're vet enough to know that:
- GMs NEVER answer posts that ask about bans on the forums,
- they won't talk to you about it since it's not you who was banned,
- they'll stick to the support ticket, since it was already made, so no need for further forum posts.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: SilentIce on February 20, 2011, 01:58:40 pm
Who are we talking about?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 20, 2011, 04:58:33 pm
I just want to bump this up to get some GM explanation as my friends ticket was left unanswered for days.
Yes it was explained that he was banned for banned evasion. but still....

quick recap:

He started playing awhile back 2009. Did some silly stuff(ad fraud) and got banned February 2010. Former GM, Fidelis advice him thats he can just create new accts. So he created one soon after he got banned. 2 months later, he created 2nd forum acct since his first one got banned aswell. Then Febuary 2011 GM Tesla banned him for banned evasion.

I would understand if he purposely try to evade the ban, but he was told that he can just create a new one and start all over again.
It just makes no sense for the GM to deny him all the hard work that he put in trying get himself back on track.

Its unfortunate that he has to go through this whole ordeal. I'm disappointed to the GM/s action on his case.
Yeah, it's not the GM's fault that he broke the rules back then, to begin with. Also, the GM told him to make a new INGAME account, but he made a new FORUM account. Don't always make it seem like the GMs are at fault for everything.

Anyway, why do you bump this topic? You're vet enough to know that:
- GMs NEVER answer posts that ask about bans on the forums,
- they won't talk to you about it since it's not you who was banned,
- they'll stick to the support ticket, since it was already made, so no need for further forum posts.

Lol Why let someone make a new account if he'll be considered a rule breaker forever? Just perma ban and don't give them false hope. Fucking GMs.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 20, 2011, 07:17:41 pm
My gears are stuck on his account. =(
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: skith on February 20, 2011, 08:11:31 pm
My gears are stuck on his account. =(

Good to know. :)
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 20, 2011, 11:06:05 pm
My gears are stuck on his account. =(

Good to know. :)

Yhea yhea. So youre one of those kind people. =P
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Forgotten Experiment on February 21, 2011, 04:10:34 am
My gears are stuck on his account. =(

Good to know. :)

Yhea yhea. So youre one of those kind people. =P
Teehee! ;D :D ;) :)
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: hebe2000 on February 21, 2011, 06:23:20 am
My gears are stuck on his account. =(
lol , alu u know the one got banned?? Wat equip u lose?? Long time no see.. U still woe??
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 21, 2011, 08:01:35 am
Haven't played for a month or two, busy with other stuff. been almost week and still waiting for GM on my ticket. =/

Kaho, Valk Shield, Sleips, Bris

My gears are stuck on his account. =(

Good to know. :)

Yhea yhea. So youre one of those kind people. =P
Teehee! ;D :D ;) :)

 ???
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 21, 2011, 12:43:53 pm
I just want to bump this up to get some GM explanation as my friends ticket was left unanswered for days.
Yes it was explained that he was banned for banned evasion. but still....

quick recap:

He started playing awhile back 2009. Did some silly stuff(ad fraud) and got banned February 2010. Former GM, Fidelis advice him thats he can just create new accts. So he created one soon after he got banned. 2 months later, he created 2nd forum acct since his first one got banned aswell. Then Febuary 2011 GM Tesla banned him for banned evasion.

I would understand if he purposely try to evade the ban, but he was told that he can just create a new one and start all over again.
It just makes no sense for the GM to deny him all the hard work that he put in trying get himself back on track.

Its unfortunate that he has to go through this whole ordeal. I'm disappointed to the GM/s action on his case.
Yeah, it's not the GM's fault that he broke the rules back then, to begin with. Also, the GM told him to make a new INGAME account, but he made a new FORUM account. Don't always make it seem like the GMs are at fault for everything.

Anyway, why do you bump this topic? You're vet enough to know that:
- GMs NEVER answer posts that ask about bans on the forums,
- they won't talk to you about it since it's not you who was banned,
- they'll stick to the support ticket, since it was already made, so no need for further forum posts.

Lol Why let someone make a new account if he'll be considered a rule breaker forever? Just perma ban and don't give them false hope. Fucking GMs.
Sorry, but are you stupid? He won't be considered a rule breaker forever, he just isn't allowed to create another FORUM account, that's it. He can create 700 GAME accounts and farm all day if he wants, no problem. If people are so forgetful that they can't remember they were forum banned, well, it's their problem.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 21, 2011, 02:12:14 pm
That's not what I meant. I mean he broke a rule a year ago, that's fine, he got punished for it. A year later you're still talking down to him as if he's been breaking rules ever since. Just douchery in my opinion. Gotta learn to let things go, Fidel.


And the other thing. Just seems stupid to me to let them make ingame accounts when they can't even make a forum account to go along with it. Sure it's not like it's a necessary thing but it really does help especially if you're trying to play the game well and want to learn more about things ingame. I'd understand if there were still ads to be frauded but that shit was gone ages ago.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 21, 2011, 02:40:04 pm
That's not what I meant. I mean he broke a rule a year ago, that's fine, he got punished for it. A year later you're still talking down to him as if he's been breaking rules ever since. Just douchery in my opinion. Gotta learn to let things go, Fidel.


And the other thing. Just seems stupid to me to let them make ingame accounts when they can't even make a forum account to go along with it. Sure it's not like it's a necessary thing but it really does help especially if you're trying to play the game well and want to learn more about things ingame. I'd understand if there were still ads to be frauded but that shit was gone ages ago.
It's just another rule. If you have been banned on the forums, you may not create another forum account. If you still do it, well, tough luck! What's so hard about following rules? Row row fight the power or what? Games need rules, if you just let everything go, a lot of douches will come and complain why they haven't been unbanned. It has always been and it will always be like this. AnimusRO rules are also pretty light, compared to other games/online communities, just saying.

Well, as I said, make a suggestion for it, if you think it's fair! But then make up your mind: either have voting + ads back sometime in the future, or get rid of forum perma bans.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: hebe2000 on February 21, 2011, 03:08:14 pm
Haven't played for a month or two, busy with other stuff. been almost week and still waiting for GM on my ticket. =/

Kaho, Valk Shield, Sleips, Bris

My gears are stuck on his account. =(
Good to know. :)

Yhea yhea. So youre one of those kind people. =P
Teehee! ;D :D ;) :)

 ???
No wonder didn't see you around.....Good luck in getting your gears back...
Don't simply borrow anyone le next time...But you can borrow me..xD
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 21, 2011, 03:08:55 pm
That's not what I meant. I mean he broke a rule a year ago, that's fine, he got punished for it. A year later you're still talking down to him as if he's been breaking rules ever since. Just douchery in my opinion. Gotta learn to let things go, Fidel.


And the other thing. Just seems stupid to me to let them make ingame accounts when they can't even make a forum account to go along with it. Sure it's not like it's a necessary thing but it really does help especially if you're trying to play the game well and want to learn more about things ingame. I'd understand if there were still ads to be frauded but that shit was gone ages ago.
It's just another rule. If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck! What's so hard about following rules? Row row fight the power or what? Games need rules, if you just let everything go, a lot of douches will come and complain why they haven't been unbanned. It has always been and it will always be like this. AnimusRO rules are also pretty light, compared to other games/online communities, just saying.

Well, as I said, make a suggestion for it, if you think it's fair! But then make up your mind: either have voting + ads back sometime in the future, or get rid of forum perma bans.
Just because it's a rule doesn't make it not stupid.

http://www.dumblaws.com/

As for taking out the rules or not, I don't really care. Just pointing out that it's stupid. :P
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 21, 2011, 04:21:08 pm
So he made a new account, did he make another account other than from that new account he made to AD fraud?

By the looks of it he just made one in order to gain access of the forums for social purposes and to access information, not to AD fraud.

And even though he did. Is there even AD credit to fraud now? I thought the only way you can get ADs now is throught donation or rewards, thus resulting to our economy now, which prices are controlled by donators.

Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Kiba on February 21, 2011, 05:16:53 pm
That's not what I meant. I mean he broke a rule a year ago, that's fine, he got punished for it. A year later you're still talking down to him as if he's been breaking rules ever since. Just douchery in my opinion. Gotta learn to let things go, Fidel.


And the other thing. Just seems stupid to me to let them make ingame accounts when they can't even make a forum account to go along with it. Sure it's not like it's a necessary thing but it really does help especially if you're trying to play the game well and want to learn more about things ingame. I'd understand if there were still ads to be frauded but that shit was gone ages ago.
It's just another rule. If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck! What's so hard about following rules? Row row fight the power or what? Games need rules, if you just let everything go, a lot of douches will come and complain why they haven't been unbanned. It has always been and it will always be like this. AnimusRO rules are also pretty light, compared to other games/online communities, just saying.

Well, as I said, make a suggestion for it, if you think it's fair! But then make up your mind: either have voting + ads back sometime in the future, or get rid of forum perma bans.
Just because it's a rule doesn't make it not stupid.

http://www.dumblaws.com/

As for taking out the rules or not, I don't really care. Just pointing out that it's stupid. :P

Just shut up already, Neetox? You're making yourself look dumber and dumber with every post in this thread.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 21, 2011, 05:32:47 pm
*skims thread*

I'd have to say that I agree with it being an obsolete rule. You can't really add fraud with no more voting and it's a little impractical to let people have a new ingame account but no forums account because in some cases there are things that an ingame account just can't do making it necessary. Besides, if you didn't catch it to ban them a year ago I'd almost say you don't deserve to ban them anymore since you know... you could have tried harder to catch that a looooooong while ago instead of waiting until they had a ton of items/characters to loose.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Dr!f$+3r on February 21, 2011, 05:37:16 pm
That's not what I meant. I mean he broke a rule a year ago, that's fine, he got punished for it. A year later you're still talking down to him as if he's been breaking rules ever since. Just douchery in my opinion. Gotta learn to let things go, Fidel.


And the other thing. Just seems stupid to me to let them make ingame accounts when they can't even make a forum account to go along with it. Sure it's not like it's a necessary thing but it really does help especially if you're trying to play the game well and want to learn more about things ingame. I'd understand if there were still ads to be frauded but that shit was gone ages ago.
It's just another rule. If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck! What's so hard about following rules? Row row fight the power or what? Games need rules, if you just let everything go, a lot of douches will come and complain why they haven't been unbanned. It has always been and it will always be like this. AnimusRO rules are also pretty light, compared to other games/online communities, just saying.

Well, as I said, make a suggestion for it, if you think it's fair! But then make up your mind: either have voting + ads back sometime in the future, or get rid of forum perma bans.

 "If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck!"

What you (Fedil person) just said about creating a new account goes back to this statement and answers it...

But I dont see any rules where it states that all newly create account can be banned if you created a new forum account.
Coz my friend got banned for that reason (I think). He got ban 1 year ago for ad fraud. He created a new account soon after a GM mentioned that he can do so. And 1 year later, he got banned again for supposedly "ban evasion". Now im not sure if he did create a new forum account, but then again, I dont see any rule that specifically states you cant create a new forum account and also Why they waited this long after getting back on his feet again just to get all his hard work taken away like a grown up taking a toy from a baby.



*skims thread*

I'd have to say that I agree with it being an obsolete rule. You can't really add fraud with no more voting and it's a little impractical to let people have a new ingame account but no forums account because in some cases there are things that an ingame account just can't do making it necessary. Besides, if you didn't catch it to ban them a year ago I'd almost say you don't deserve to ban them anymore since you know... you could have tried harder to catch that a looooooong while ago instead of waiting until they had a ton of items/characters to loose.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: john rayl on February 21, 2011, 05:55:19 pm
Hi drex!  ;)
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 21, 2011, 06:10:46 pm
That's not what I meant. I mean he broke a rule a year ago, that's fine, he got punished for it. A year later you're still talking down to him as if he's been breaking rules ever since. Just douchery in my opinion. Gotta learn to let things go, Fidel.


And the other thing. Just seems stupid to me to let them make ingame accounts when they can't even make a forum account to go along with it. Sure it's not like it's a necessary thing but it really does help especially if you're trying to play the game well and want to learn more about things ingame. I'd understand if there were still ads to be frauded but that shit was gone ages ago.
It's just another rule. If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck! What's so hard about following rules? Row row fight the power or what? Games need rules, if you just let everything go, a lot of douches will come and complain why they haven't been unbanned. It has always been and it will always be like this. AnimusRO rules are also pretty light, compared to other games/online communities, just saying.

Well, as I said, make a suggestion for it, if you think it's fair! But then make up your mind: either have voting + ads back sometime in the future, or get rid of forum perma bans.

 "If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck!"

What you (Fedil person) just said about creating a new account goes back to this statement and answers it...

But I dont see any rules where it states that all newly create account can be banned if you created a new forum account.
Coz my friend got banned for that reason (I think). He got ban 1 year ago for ad fraud. He created a new account soon after a GM mentioned that he can do so. And 1 year later, he got banned again for supposedly "ban evasion". Now im not sure if he did create a new forum account, but then again, I dont see any rule that specifically states you cant create a new forum account and also Why they waited this long after getting back on his feet again just to get all his hard work taken away like a grown up taking a toy from a baby.



*skims thread*

I'd have to say that I agree with it being an obsolete rule. You can't really add fraud with no more voting and it's a little impractical to let people have a new ingame account but no forums account because in some cases there are things that an ingame account just can't do making it necessary. Besides, if you didn't catch it to ban them a year ago I'd almost say you don't deserve to ban them anymore since you know... you could have tried harder to catch that a looooooong while ago instead of waiting until they had a ton of items/characters to loose.

Fidelis was talking about a forum account. I don't see where in the rules it says that you can remake an ingame account but you're not permitted to make a new forum account after being perma banned, though. The part he highlighted in the Punishment Guidelines doesn't apply here unless you start adding invisible words in there.

Anyway, it doesn't matter. They can do whatever they want whenever they want. He better hope one of the GMs likes him. lol
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Dr!f$+3r on February 21, 2011, 06:45:18 pm
 Ah, I see :( my mistake then...
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 21, 2011, 06:47:09 pm
*skims thread*

I'd have to say that I agree with it being an obsolete rule. You can't really add fraud with no more voting and it's a little impractical to let people have a new ingame account but no forums account because in some cases there are things that an ingame account just can't do making it necessary. Besides, if you didn't catch it to ban them a year ago I'd almost say you don't deserve to ban them anymore since you know... you could have tried harder to catch that a looooooong while ago instead of waiting until they had a ton of items/characters to loose.
That's like saying, "Oh, let's just unban all the botters/bug abusers/scammers etc., because it's not possible anymore!" (ok, scamming & botting is possible, but I think you get what I mean). That individual was banned in the past for ad fraud, and as a policy, all bans from the past stay intact in case they were legitimate.
Also, no idea if the GMs caught the banned player just now, or maybe he created a new forum account just recently. Well, and yes, as I already said in this topic somewhere, I don't know the entire circumstances, so if that's his first ban evasion, his new ingame accounts shouldn't have been banned, so it's just a matter of posting a one liner in the support ticket to re-check how many times he has been banned on the forums. But maybe it's not his first, who knows?

"If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck!"

What you (Fedil person) just said about creating a new account goes back to this statement and answers it...

But I dont see any rules where it states that all newly create account can be banned if you created a new forum account.
Coz my friend got banned for that reason (I think). He got ban 1 year ago for ad fraud. He created a new account soon after a GM mentioned that he can do so. And 1 year later, he got banned again for supposedly "ban evasion". Now im not sure if he did create a new forum account, but then again, I dont see any rule that specifically states you cant create a new forum account and also Why they waited this long after getting back on his feet again just to get all his hard work taken away like a grown up taking a toy from a baby.
Oh, come on, people, if you want to participate in the discussion, please read the damn thread. It's about a FORUM account (I am talking about a forum account in my post), not a damn INGAME account (that's what bLitzkr!eg is talking about in his post).

Fidelis was talking about a forum account. I don't see where in the rules it says that you can remake an ingame account but you're not permitted to make a new forum account after being perma banned, though. The part he highlighted in the Punishment Guidelines doesn't apply here unless you start adding invisible words in there.
Oh, fuck what's written down in the rules. If you are PERMANENTLY banned from a forum, it's pretty much self explanatory that you are not allowed to create a new forum account, which is considered as ban evasion. It has always been like this, why complain now? I hate it when people get so nit-picky over what's written down in the rules and what's not.

Anyway, it doesn't matter. They can do whatever they want whenever they want. He better hope one of the GMs likes him. lol
Of course they CAN. But they DON'T, because they don't abuse their power. Even though there are guidelines and rules, they have to treat every case as an individual one, which is the reason why stuff usually takes a while.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Forgotten Experiment on February 21, 2011, 06:55:39 pm
"If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck!"

What if the GMs told him/her to just create a new fresh forum account on a certain date? but he didn't do it on that certain date and did it to early? =x?
Example? Anniversary of his bann on his first forum account, that was banned for Ad Fraud?!??!
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 21, 2011, 07:04:27 pm
"If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck!"

What if the GMs told him/her to just create a new fresh forum account on a certain date? but he didn't do it on that certain date and did it to early? =x?
Example? Anniversary of his bann on his first forum account, that was banned for Ad Fraud?!??!
Nah, I don't think the GM handling that case said something like this. Usually, when you're permanently forum banned for ad frauding, you'll stay permanently forum banned, as a punishment for trying to cheat, taking away the privileges of the forum.
The GM certainly told the player that he could make another ingame account, since that's usually the first answer to such a ticket:

Player: I HAS BEEN BANNED WHY?
GM: You have been banned for vote fraud on the following accounts: xyz, xyz2, xyz3, ... As a punishment, all of your ingame accounts are banned as well as your forum accounts, and you must not create another forum account. You may, however, start over and create new ingame accounts if you like.

or something along those lines.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Forgotten Experiment on February 21, 2011, 07:07:30 pm
Interesting...
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 21, 2011, 07:09:05 pm
*skims thread*

I'd have to say that I agree with it being an obsolete rule. You can't really add fraud with no more voting and it's a little impractical to let people have a new ingame account but no forums account because in some cases there are things that an ingame account just can't do making it necessary. Besides, if you didn't catch it to ban them a year ago I'd almost say you don't deserve to ban them anymore since you know... you could have tried harder to catch that a looooooong while ago instead of waiting until they had a ton of items/characters to loose.
That's like saying, "Oh, let's just unban all the botters/bug abusers/scammers etc., because it's not possible anymore!" (ok, scamming & botting is possible, but I think you get what I mean). That individual was banned in the past for ad fraud, and as a policy, all bans from the past stay intact in case they were legitimate.
Also, no idea if the GMs caught the banned player just now, or maybe he created a new forum account just recently. Well, and yes, as I already said in this topic somewhere, I don't know the entire circumstances, so if that's his first ban evasion, his new ingame accounts shouldn't have been banned, so it's just a matter of posting a one liner in the support ticket to re-check how many times he has been banned on the forums. But maybe it's not his first, who knows?

Actually no, no it's really not. I'm not attacking you or anything just giving my small impartial 2 cents so have a cookie, take a deep breath, make out with Kiba for my voyeuristic pleasure and calm down a bit.

Botting, bug abusing, and scamming generally hurt the player base as a whole and are capable of unbalancing the game quite easily. Unlawfully gaining a few pennies is a much smaller crime and in my honest opinion can't do much to harm our population. And I'm not saying to unban everyone just that in this one particular case I think the punishment is a little high handed. If you had banned them back when they first made another account it wouldn't have even been a problem because they wouldn't have lost a years worth of honest effort because someone took their sweat time getting to them. You'll have to forgive me for having enough faith in the moderation to believe that you guys are generally understanding of each individual circumstance and like to treat each person like an individual instead of a cookie cutter case. Unbanning a single user who violated a rule a long time ago and may or may not have done it again thanks to an unclarified grey-zone in the rules is not an all or nothing deal and you know that. That's just grouping everything as an excuse to deny everything. I. Am. Disappoint.

I expect better from you so please live up to that expectation. Even if it is to much to ask of you I'll ask and or demand it anyways. This place is like my second home I come here to let everyone here know everything before most other people. Heck, you guys were the second group of people to find out when I became an aunt (the first group was the people there in the birthing room with me) and that was/is a big deal for me.  No matter what you would like to say with the information available this does not seem fair so don't go around backing semi-underhanded things that ruin my home away from home.  *kicks and glares*

It's days like this that I miss the conduct code of my Yuyu.

Either way I also don't think it's fair or even appropriate for a mod to insist that a player absolutely deserved their ban if you don't know the full story and aren't properly informed. It's supposed to go innocence until proven guilty not the other way around. It's not like you've never banned an innocent party and had to unban them later. =.=

Now make with my yaoi or I'll hate you for the next 3 weeks. *waits*

EDITS: Better still why not do a server wide poll and let the players decide if that kind of rule is even needed on our server. I can bet you $50 of add credit right now that they will tell you it's not. Care to take my wager?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 21, 2011, 07:15:18 pm
"If you have been banned, you may not create another account. If you still do it, well, tough luck!"

What if the GMs told him/her to just create a new fresh forum account on a certain date? but he didn't do it on that certain date and did it to early? =x?
Example? Anniversary of his bann on his first forum account, that was banned for Ad Fraud?!??!
Nah, I don't think the GM handling that case said something like this. Usually, when you're permanently forum banned for ad frauding, you'll stay permanently forum banned, as a punishment for trying to cheat, taking away the privileges of the forum.
The GM certainly told the player that he could make another ingame account, since that's usually the first answer to such a ticket:

Player: I HAS BEEN BANNED WHY?
GM: You have been banned for vote fraud on the following accounts: xyz, xyz2, xyz3, ... As a punishment, all of your ingame accounts are banned as well as your forum accounts, and you must not create another forum account. You may, however, start over and create new ingame accounts if you like.

or something along those lines.

I can understand he got banned for AD frauding.

But on the "Ban Evasion's" case.

He misunderstood and was under the impression that he was granted by the GM that he could make another forum account being allowed to make another in-game acocunt and had no intentions of breaking the rules, just an honest mistake.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: DreamerP on February 21, 2011, 07:18:50 pm
No offense to anyone but Fedilis is just going by what he recalls when he was a GM. HE'S NOT A GM ANYMORE NOR WILL HE RESOLVE YOUR PROBLEMS. In other words posting on the forums regarding this problem will not solve it. Take your words to the tickets /thread
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 21, 2011, 07:23:17 pm
Fidelis was talking about a forum account. I don't see where in the rules it says that you can remake an ingame account but you're not permitted to make a new forum account after being perma banned, though. The part he highlighted in the Punishment Guidelines doesn't apply here unless you start adding invisible words in there.
Oh, fuck what's written down in the rules. If you are PERMANENTLY banned from a forum, it's pretty much self explanatory that you are not allowed to create a new forum account, which is considered as ban evasion. It has always been like this, why complain now? I hate it when people get so nit-picky over what's written down in the rules and what's not.
lol what? I'm just saying, according to that statement, if you're permanently banned ingame one should assume you're not supposed to create a new ingame account, right? But since the GM said you could make an ingame account and didn't say anything about not making a forum account, what if people assume you're allowed to make a forum account as well? All I'm saying is to be clear. Shouldn't be the person's fault for not assuming correctly.

And Dreamer, I'm not trying to resolve an issue. I'm only pointing out how the GMs while being imperfect like us, shouldn't punish others for their own imperfections. :P
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 21, 2011, 07:28:58 pm
And another thing I don't understand... If it's okay to have new in game accounts but not a forums account why ban the in game account at all instead of just taking away the forums account since you'd let them make another new in game one anyways? If they haven't ad frauded again or done anything with that second forums account that led to an immoral profit on their in game account then there is no reason to even touch the in game account just for possession of a forums account. If they never used it to do anything bad as far as the game account is concerned it existed the same way it would have even if they had no forums account.

That would be a nice compromise. You get the forums ban you want to uphold and you don't steal a year's worth of someone elses hard work for your own amusement. You don't really have to take everything from them to get the forumless effect that you seem to want.

Typo-chi
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 21, 2011, 07:31:26 pm
And another thing I don't understand... If it's okay to have new in game accounts but not a forums account why ban the in game account at all instead of just taking away the forums account since you'd let them make another new in game one anyways? If they haven't ad frauded again or done anything with that second forums account that led to an immoral profit on their in game account then there is no reason to even touch the in game account just for possession of a forums account. If they never used it to do anything bad as far as the game account is concerned it existed the same way it would have even if they had no forums account.

That would be a nice compromise. You get the forums ban you want to uphold and you don't steal a year's worth of someone elses hard work for your own amusement. You don't really have to take everything from them to get the forumless effect that you seem to want.

Typo-chi

Becase "Ban Evasion" is under the major offense's list which results to perma ban on all your accounts.

But what we are trying to say, in his case is that.

He misunderstood and was under the impression that he was granted by the GM that he could make another forum account being allowed to make another in-game acocunt and had no intentions of breaking the rules, just an honest mistake.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 21, 2011, 07:35:32 pm
Becase its under the major offense's list which resolts to perma ban on all your accounts.

But what we are trying to say, in his case is that.

He misunderstood and was under the impression that he was granted by the GM that he could make another forum account being allowed to make another in-game acocunt and had no intentions of breaking the rules, just an honest mistake.
It's an impossible offense as of the 2nd time they were actually banned but I won't go there.

Indeed, it does sound like a misunderstanding. That's exactly why the way it was handled bothers me. If I was allowed to do something that I didn't know broke the rules unintentionally and I was also allowed to do it for a whole year before anything happened... well I'd be pretty confused myself. Leaving the account be for more than 3 months is pretty much like giving it a green light. At least in my mind that would be it.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: aaronumerouno on February 21, 2011, 08:47:21 pm
for me being a GM should be able to consider and to know whats right from wrong regarding on banning a player.

In my opinion what they did to this banned individual is WRONG, making a new forum account for the purpose of being able to see the News , Announcements and socializing with other players in the server through the forums is obviously his intention and it is a fact that ad voting is gone long ago so there is no reason for him to do ad frauding. Yes, rules are rules if u say so, but regarding the game accounts on which he made and worked hard for after he was banned the first time shouldnt be banned again specially that u guys banned him 1 year after, just because he made a new forum account which he didnt knew was illegal.

GMs i know u guys dont look on this thread but if u do i hope it would make u decide for what is right and make u remember that our server is not growing at all and banning more players will result to decline of population and rate of being active of players.


Warning - while you were typing 10 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 22, 2011, 01:24:19 am
I don't have a lot of time, so my answers here will be pretty short.

Why is everyone talking like he knows the banned player personally? "I'm sure the player just wanted to create the forum account to read news and socialize with other players." Yeah, you most definitely know. I doubt it's a misunderstanding if he created the forum account a year afterwards. He most likely just forgot, or tried to look if it's now safe to create an account.

Also, I consider vote fraud as a far more serious offense than you think. A few pennies? Usually, it's around a few hundred pennies. Multiplied by several players each month. When a player can suddenly get an MVP card out of nothing, I would start to be worried...
And no offense to anyone, just stating my opinion about this. And Haruwa, keep in mind that this is still a game. So if an individual is banned, it doesn't mean the end of the world for anyone.

Of course players will vote in favor of the rule being abolished. Players will also vote in favor of the bug abuse rule being abolished. Or the recovery fees being abolished. Players will always vote for stuff that makes "life" easier for them.

I'm just stating my opinion, but it's probably more important that you state yours, since you guys still play this game. So instead of posting nonsense in this nonsense thread, make a suggestion to change the rules or whatever. Or simply stop breaking the rules, and none of this would've happened.  :police:
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 22, 2011, 02:06:24 am
A few hundred pennies still only makes a few dollar which does not an MVP card make.

A game or not doing something like this once is to much since it sets a bad precedent for future cases/misunderstandings and regardless of weather is a game or something IRL I very much despise it when someone's hard work gets torn down without a very good reason. I personally would hunt down and skin alive anyone who dared to put their hands on my accounts after several hours of mental and physical torture that is. Digital or not a prized possession still has a good amount of sentimental value invested in to it. So "it's just a game" is not a very convincing and is the standard straw-man argument in any online altercation. Just like "they're just pixels" if that's the thought process then I could say that ad pennies are just fake money made up of 1's and 0's so it doesn't matter if they're frauded because they aren't real currency just game currency or the fabricated representation of real currency. Ad credit is to Animus what monopoly money is to Monopoly which obviously makes it less important my your train of thought.

The bug abuse part is a little far fetched. I seem to recall quite a few blow ups over that topic in the past and in the end the majority still thought that bug abuse shouldn't be allowed. The recovery fee is a necessary evil most everyone dislikes and you're doing that grouping thing again... Just because 1 options 1 and 3 may be valid does not mean you can rope option 2 into the mix and still call the whole argument the truth. *stares*

*issue a solid swift kick for yet another generalization*
Having a problem with the way the rules are being enforced doesn't mean I or anyone else you're generalizing has/have broken the rules before. I think I have possibly got a few warning(s) for arguing on the forums but as far as I can remember I've never earned a ban or mute.

I also don't think you should belittle someone else's misfortune by calling it nonsense. *glares more*

And above all else, I don't see you making with the yaoi so let me help you with that. /gg
A 10mill reward for the person who draws the best yaoi pic of Fidelis being molest-a-mated. NSFW gets a bonus.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Kiba on February 22, 2011, 02:44:43 am
Fidelis is still the only one making any sense in this thread.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 22, 2011, 03:52:18 am
I never generalized that everyone else who has a problem with the rules is a rule breaker. I was going to do that, but since you already said it, Haruwa, damn you!!
Well, maybe it's just me who has no problem with the rules as they are, since it's usually not like you accidentally break them, or do you?

I also don't think you should belittle someone else's misfortune by calling it nonsense. *glares more*
No, this whole thread is nonsense, since it will not speed up the process of handling the case of the player. I didn't say anything bad about the player.


It just came to my mind that, if the player has been banned over a year ago, it was probably me who banned him, because as far as I know, I was the last one handling ad/vote fraud cases. Maybe he wasn't even banned for vote fraud, but for ad/credit card fraud. Then you can easily get a few hundred dollars.

Anyway, I think this thread is going nowhere without knowing why the player has really been banned for. I think we should wait for him to post in this thread -

OH WAIT, HE CAN'T POST IN THIS THREAD BECAUSE HE'S BANNED! HA!


Sorry, I know that was mean. But I just had to do it.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Alucard on February 22, 2011, 03:36:45 pm
I don't have a lot of time, so my answers here will be pretty short.

Why is everyone talking like he knows the banned player personally? "I'm sure the player just wanted to create the forum account to read news and socialize with other players." Yeah, you most definitely know. I doubt it's a misunderstanding if he created the forum account a year afterwards. He most likely just forgot, or tried to look if it's now safe to create an account.

Also, I consider vote fraud as a far more serious offense than you think. A few pennies? Usually, it's around a few hundred pennies. Multiplied by several players each month. When a player can suddenly get an MVP card out of nothing, I would start to be worried...
And no offense to anyone, just stating my opinion about this. And Haruwa, keep in mind that this is still a game. So if an individual is banned, it doesn't mean the end of the world for anyone.

Of course players will vote in favor of the rule being abolished. Players will also vote in favor of the bug abuse rule being abolished. Or the recovery fees being abolished. Players will always vote for stuff that makes "life" easier for them.

I'm just stating my opinion, but it's probably more important that you state yours, since you guys still play this game. So instead of posting nonsense in this nonsense thread, make a suggestion to change the rules or whatever. Or simply stop breaking the rules, and none of this would've happened.  :police:

I can understand an offense is an offense and there fore should be punished accordinly, but in this case the offense was made due to an assumption from what a GM has decided, its a simople mistake, a misunderstanding, a misinterpretation, human error someone else could have also done. So I hope they will reconsider.

We are not suggesting the rule to be changed.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 22, 2011, 04:11:25 pm
I never generalized that everyone else who has a problem with the rules is a rule breaker. I was going to do that, but since you already said it, Haruwa, damn you!!
Well, maybe it's just me who has no problem with the rules as they are, since it's usually not like you accidentally break them, or do you?

I also don't think you should belittle someone else's misfortune by calling it nonsense. *glares more*
No, this whole thread is nonsense, since it will not speed up the process of handling the case of the player. I didn't say anything bad about the player.


It just came to my mind that, if the player has been banned over a year ago, it was probably me who banned him, because as far as I know, I was the last one handling ad/vote fraud cases. Maybe he wasn't even banned for vote fraud, but for ad/credit card fraud. Then you can easily get a few hundred dollars.

Anyway, I think this thread is going nowhere without knowing why the player has really been banned for. I think we should wait for him to post in this thread -

OH WAIT, HE CAN'T POST IN THIS THREAD BECAUSE HE'S BANNED! HA!


Sorry, I know that was mean. But I just had to do it.

Totally missed my post. You told him it was ok to make an ingame account but said nothing about not making a forum account. Like Alu said, you made a simple mistake which lots of people do. I'm not here to abolish a rule, just letting you know you're not perfect. :P
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 22, 2011, 04:16:26 pm
Nope, actually fidelis stated pretty clearly in that ticket he could make new ingame, but a forum account would be out of the question.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 22, 2011, 04:19:04 pm
o rly? I must've seen a different ticket then.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 22, 2011, 04:22:30 pm
Probably the same ticket he quoted to tesla, which conveniently was copy pasta'd specifically to leave out the bit of fidelis' quote that said the forum account was out of the question.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Neetox on February 22, 2011, 04:50:12 pm
Probably the same ticket he quoted to tesla, which conveniently was copy pasta'd specifically to leave out the bit of fidelis' quote that said the forum account was out of the question.

Well shit, if that's true, then I agree with Kiba about me. That's what I get for believing people I guess. Either way, I'm not too happy with the GMs atm. So meh.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: aaronumerouno on February 22, 2011, 09:18:16 pm
look he ban evaded in the forums cuz he made mistake in the forums but why ban the in game account aswell?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 22, 2011, 10:50:41 pm
Because ad frauding is a pretty solid basis on what messed up the animus economy as bad as it is now.  Ad frauding leads to banning, and we let them create new in game accounts, telling them they cannot do any forum accounts, and that if they did, it'd be considered ban evasion, and action would be taken.  Since re-banning forum accounts over and over really isn't an issue for someone to just keep re-making them, banning in game accounts sends a much clearer "STOP" message.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 22, 2011, 11:08:00 pm
So in other words, use a mountain to crush a spider when a pebble would do. *stares*
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 22, 2011, 11:48:12 pm
In your metaphor, I would like you to explain what you think the appropriate "pebble" would be.  Players are expected to read the rules, we state it in the rules ban evasion will have an effect on your in game accounts.  When banned for ad frauding, we state you may re-make in game accounts, but no new forum accounts.  It seems like a very clear cut thing.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 23, 2011, 12:15:53 am
The appropriate pebble would to just IP ban then on the forums only and to take out any new (forum only) accounts they make as necessary. If you made it impossible for them to make a new account with an IP(s) ban they couldn't make a mistake about weather they were allowed to have a forums account or not. The fact that they still have the ability to make another forum account without doing anything underhanded or special is asking for a misunderstanding to happen.

IMO the only time someone should loose an in game account, since they can continue to have and make as many in game accounts as they please quite lawfully, is if that in game account made some kind of underhanded profit through the use of the forums account. If not then for the life of me I can't see how one is really matters to the other and it doesn't hurt anything to leave the in game account alone in that case because they didn't do anything wrong with it.

I suppose I think there should be a difference between possession and use. Just having something isn't really all that bad if you're not using it in a way you shouldn't. For example I have nice strong legs that I could kick you with them many many many tens of thousands of times if I really wanted to despite a certain person telling me not to. If I chose to do it anyways and a punishment was given so that I could never kick you again it wouldn't exactly be a fair trade off if you manged my legs and then gave my arms the same treatment simply because they are also mine.

EDITS: In this case it would also be like you came back and crushed my arms a second time after I had just wasted a years worth of time, effort, and money to replace my old manged pair with functional prosthetic arms.

A little extreme but I'm tired and you get my point. *ponders if poking you thousands of time is also a no no*
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 23, 2011, 01:33:48 am
It's not like they accidentally create a forum account and then get banned. They were told that creating another forum account is not allowed, they fully knew that they were going against the rules by doing so. Even if it was a year afterwards.

Besides, forum accounts ARE IP bans, but there are countries with dynamic IPs (for example Germany and Malaysia, I think India as well), so you can just reset your router or wait a day, and you've got a new IP address. There's nothing the GMs can do about that, except for banning whole IP ranges of a country, but I don't think you'd like that.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 23, 2011, 01:45:14 am
Was this before or after all of the name changes etc? If after that's reason enough for confusion. If I can't make a new account on say... HarumachimaRO and it name changes to... UkemolestixRO well yeah... To tired to type out my whole argument further I'll come back for you when I wake up and then the last vestiges of your innocence shall be bathed in true darkness... or something... idk... sleepy... Anyways with all the name changes and even the switch to Aegis or whatever we have now I don't relay think this can be considered the same server as it was before.

What happened to the days of people keeping a single IP.  *sigh*
Oh well forget that part I guess. *hog ties Fidelis for use as a personal bish pillow*

You still owe me a yaoi influenced may out eye candy session btw. Night night.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Razer on February 23, 2011, 02:35:06 am
I think India as well
Depends on ISP. My current ISP provides a static ISP. Although , you could hide behind a proxy and make your IP look different or even use a VPN.

Quote
but I don't think you'd like that.
Neither would the staff, since if you go around banning country IPs you'd pretty much end up with negative reviews , lack of player base and eventually dead server.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 23, 2011, 01:44:17 pm
Haruwa, ad frauding is a PERFECT example of what you mean when you say:

IMO the only time someone should loose an in game account, since they can continue to have and make as many in game accounts as they please quite lawfully, is if that in game account made some kind of underhanded profit through the use of the forums account. If not then for the life of me I can't see how one is really matters to the other and it doesn't hurt anything to leave the in game account alone in that case because they didn't do anything wrong with it.

And because of this action, it's deemed that that player loses their forum privileges completely, like we've said, they are welcome to create as many in game accounts as possible, but that action (of ad frauding in this case) is, or is capable of being, extremely destructive to the server as a whole.  Since like Fidelis said, IP's are EASILY changed, a simple IP ban is never enough, even though that's what's usually done, the extra incentive is added to not create more forum accounts because we'll move to your in game accounts, which most players care about.

And as far as I'm aware, this is how all cases have been handled, throughout the many names our server has seen.

Your example of kicking doesn't make much sense, as in your example you did nothing to provoke the second attack, but in this case, there was provocation on the offender's part that broke the rules, and thus caused a reaction from us.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Haruwa on February 23, 2011, 02:10:47 pm
Indeed it is... for the first time.

If they didn't ad fraud the second time as well then they shouldn't loose their in game accounts.

My example does make plenty of sense. Banning them in game and out again out of the blue after a whole year is pretty random and unless they were doing something bad with the new forum account it does seem kinda unprovoked. I honestly don't see the harm in them having the forums account if they learned their lesson and if after all this time they didn't do anything bad with it... well I think the good behavior should be taken into account since they had plenty of time to cause trouble but didn't and obviously did learn something from the first punishment because they didn't cause any trouble this time around. I can't see them learning anything from this second time can you? *takes your moral high ground and burns it* If they didn't make a new forum account just to break the rules and do more less than legal things then just take the forums account away again and be done with it there unlike the first time just chatting with friends or making a selling thread or two is not harmful to the server in any way. I mean really. There should be a statute of limitations on catching those kind of things. Otherwise it's excessive use of force.

I'm not saying you shouldn't react just that the way your reacting is a bit much.
It's like punching someone for bumping into you. Yeah they maybe shouldn't have been in there but still...

They may not have been doing their part as a player properly by making another forums account but more than anything you guys failed them as mods too. If you tired harder and did your job properly they wouldn't have lost all their much honest work invested into that in game account because you could/would have caught this right away. ARO staff is human, I get it, sometimes mistakes happen and things slip through the cracks but all that fine understanding should go both ways sometimes. It's not a real second chance despite what you guys want to call it when you won't compromise a single inch on anything and your so easily willing to suspect someone is up to no good or eternally crucify them for a past mistake just so you can take everything they've put fair, rule abiding, honest work into away from them.

Either way I give up on this topic. Talking to you of all people here is the most useless thing I could possibly try since you're generally biased where my person is concerned and I don't feel like accidentally saying something excessively "bad" so you can run off at the mouth and tell Yuyu I'm bullying you again.  =3=
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Forgotten Experiment on February 23, 2011, 02:38:35 pm
Let me get this straight, Forum Account Number 1; banned for Ad Fraud [ When the Ad Voting was still available ]... He/She changed the IP address then contacted GMs by asking if there's any possibility to let them play again. But, a GM who was on the case told he/she, "You can start the Game Fresh with a New Forum Account and Game Account on the Anniversary of there First Forum Account Banning that was banned for Ad Frauding.." But! The Person made a New Forum account right away instead of making it on the Anniversary of there First Forum account banning..., which the GM told the person to do... Is there a possibility that the GMs told the person this on the First Banning of Forum Account Number 1?

Now Forum Account Number 2 got banned for...?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 23, 2011, 02:51:50 pm
Your example makes no sense, you had 0 provocation in it for the second attack.  As to "banning them in game and out again out of the blue after a whole year".  It was not out of the blue, he got banned a year ago, in game and on forum.  He was told he could make in game accounts, but forum accounts would be out of the question.  He seemed to understand eventually, despite trying to barter with us via bribery, and all was fine.  A year later, he made another forum account, which we had specifically told him was not allowed, and we followed through with the correct punishments, a banning on the forum account, and in game accounts.

Certainly some players may indeed, learn their lesson and never do it again, but unfortunately, we cannot make that choice on a case by case basis, we do not know the players personally, and thus wide judgement calls must be made on such subjects.  We cannot, and do not make exceptions for anyone, and that is how it is.

How did we fail them as mods, we caught them rule breaking the first time, and explained it, very clearly, what was going to happen, and what they were allowed, and not allowed to do.  They followed those rules fine for a while, and then broke them, and we came down on them.  Just because time passed doesn't mean we're suddenly ok with the fact that they broke some pretty major rules in the past.

Playing on the server is a privilege, not a right, and as the people put in charge of making sure it's policed correctly, Haine, Tesla, and Talis all make judgement calls on stuff like this.  They decide on how things are handled, and that's the final say.

As to my being biased, I fail to see how you're at all any deciding factor on what side I take in a fight, being as insignificant as you are in the grand scheme of things, and ironically, I do not speak with yuyu, we spoke little while we were on staff(we spoke about DA, and that was as far as our relationship went), and we speak never now that they have left staff.


Let me get this straight, Forum Account Number 1; banned for Ad Fraud [ When the Ad Voting was still available ]... He/She changed the IP address then contacted GMs by asking if there's any possibility to let them play again. But, a GM who was on the case told he/she, "You can start the Game Fresh with a New Forum Account and Game Account on the Anniversary of there First Forum Account Banning that was banned for Ad Frauding.." But! The Person made a New Forum account right away instead of making it on the Anniversary of there First Forum account banning..., which the GM told the person to do... Is there a possibility that the GMs told the person this on the First Banning of Forum Account Number 1?

Now Forum Account Number 2 got banned for...?

Forum accounts 1 through a few, banned for ad frauding.

NOBODY told them they could make a new forum account.  They were told they could make new in game accounts

They made a new forum account, and it got banned with their in game accounts as per the rules.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 23, 2011, 02:56:49 pm
Let me get this straight, Forum Account Number 1; banned for Ad Fraud [ When the Ad Voting was still available ]... He/She changed the IP address then contacted GMs by asking if there's any possibility to let them play again. But, a GM who was on the case told he/she, "You can start the Game Fresh with a New Forum Account and Game Account on the Anniversary of there First Forum Account Banning that was banned for Ad Frauding.." But! The Person made a New Forum account right away instead of making it on the Anniversary of there First Forum account banning..., which the GM told the person to do... Is there a possibility that the GMs told the person this on the First Banning of Forum Account Number 1?

Now Forum Account Number 2 got banned for...?
What's with that anniversary thing? This is already the second time you posted this, nobody ever said anything about the player being able to create another forum account on the anniversary of the first ban ... ಠ_ಠ
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: bLitzkr!eg on February 23, 2011, 06:58:03 pm
He didnt made those second forum acct 1year after.  It was created soon after he got banned the first time. Apparently he had a new IP after he got banmed so he created those forum acct not knowing it would still be illegal. He work hard to get back on his feet after almost a year to just see all his hard work to be taken away. I dont know why its so hard for you GMs to understand. Even Haine think its a lil too late for Tesla to ban the guy and yetit feels like he's  being stubborm to not even recognize that.


I know people gets unbanned for something more severe than this. Why dont they exercise their mercy for this individual who didnt intend to cause anybody harm or advantage.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Schrodinger on February 23, 2011, 08:58:02 pm
He didnt made those second forum acct 1year after.  It was created soon after he got banned the first time. Apparently he had a new IP after he got banmed so he created those forum acct not knowing it would still be illegal. He work hard to get back on his feet after almost a year to just see all his hard work to be taken away. I dont know why its so hard for you GMs to understand. Even Haine think its a lil too late for Tesla to ban the guy and yetit feels like he's  being stubborm to not even recognize that.


I know people gets unbanned for something more severe than this. Why dont they exercise their mercy for this individual who didnt intend to cause anybody harm or advantage.

Well, on the one hand (the staff side of me), then he was DEFINITELY breaking blatant rules, and disregarding fidelis' decree that in game was ok, forum was no go.  And he simply CANNOT try to defend against the fact fidelis explicitly said that forum accounts were out of the question.  (Which he tried in a pretty low tactic of trying to alter copy pasta by leaving specific parts out, which doesn't help his cause AT ALL).  His history of what he's tried in previous tickets doesn't help.

On the other hand (the player side), if it's been a while, somewhat harsh.

Regardless, in the end, it is Tesla's decision, we will uphold and back Tesla's decision, and the player's history does not help, at all, with some of the previous tactics tried in tickets.  My personal decision would probably be on the same route as Tesla, it's a little late, but rules are rules, and just because it wasn't found immediately doesn't mean it isn't any less grounds for banning.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: john rayl on February 26, 2011, 12:08:52 pm
(http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/744/drexsig.png)
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Auurium on February 26, 2011, 12:10:24 pm
(http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/744/drexsig.png)

Lol wtf is the pic I drew for Drex doing there.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Linux4ever on February 27, 2011, 01:34:09 am
What if you changed your ip address due to moving and you end up with the ad faurd ip adress?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Roon on February 27, 2011, 01:46:52 am
I'm pretty sure in such a case, the GMs can see the history of the IP addresses you used to log in from, and if the previous IP address(es) does not match up with the ad fraud one at the time of the ad frauding, then you'd be in the clear and get unbanned. I can't say I know the process but it only makes sense.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on February 27, 2011, 05:29:03 am
What if you changed your ip address due to moving and you end up with the ad faurd ip adress?
There have been some cases like this when an IP has been banned, and another player who has nothing to do with the ban, is suddenly banned. In those cases, the players usually submit a ticket immediately, and it will be handled accordingly (as Roon said, the history of the accounts/IP will be looked up, and then the ban will be lifted, most likely). But it rarely happens.
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: DreamerP on February 27, 2011, 05:50:08 pm
(http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/744/drexsig.png)

LOL I GET IT /heh
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Super Roy on March 01, 2011, 05:07:14 am
If you were banned for ad fraud, you are not allowed to create another forum account (every new forum account will be banned), but you may create new ingame accounts, of course, to start over. However, if you created a new ingame account, and ban evaded on the forums by creating a new account there, your newly made ingame account might be banned as well for ban evasion.


... at least, that was the ruling back when I was still the one responsible for the ad fraud bans. However, since it wasn't possible to ad fraud since I left, the ruling shouldn't have changed. There are no such things as IP bans ingame. At least as far as I know of. Maybe only for extreme cases, but at my time, we didn't IP ban anyone ingame.

How did I make a Forums account then?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on March 01, 2011, 09:41:31 am
If you were banned for ad fraud, you are not allowed to create another forum account (every new forum account will be banned), but you may create new ingame accounts, of course, to start over. However, if you created a new ingame account, and ban evaded on the forums by creating a new account there, your newly made ingame account might be banned as well for ban evasion.


... at least, that was the ruling back when I was still the one responsible for the ad fraud bans. However, since it wasn't possible to ad fraud since I left, the ruling shouldn't have changed. There are no such things as IP bans ingame. At least as far as I know of. Maybe only for extreme cases, but at my time, we didn't IP ban anyone ingame.

How did I make a Forums account then?
Probably because you changed your IP?
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: DreamerP on March 01, 2011, 06:51:44 pm
ITS TIME TO REPORT  :police:
Title: Re: account ban......?
Post by: Fidelis on March 01, 2011, 07:18:49 pm
Oh, don't bother. Besides, I think he isn't the same person as his brother? :P